Tom Holland & Benedict Cumberbatch Talking About Power of The Dog and Spider-man 3 #NWH #interview

Tom Holland & Benedict Cumberbatch Talking About Power of The Dog and Spider-man 3 #NWH #interview

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00:00
friend of mine is the benedict cumberbatch and today we will be talking about his new film power of the dog uh which i'm very excited to talk to you about mate and firstly congratulations the movie is it's breathtaking it's incredible thank you so much and thank you thank you for going to do this and chatting to me um i got to talk to you about it i know you saw it quite recently it's interesting the film is so shocking and it's so gut-wrenching and the intricacies of your character
00:30
i've never seen a character arc quite like it you know because because i know you so well i think i come from a very sort of privileged standpoint where when i meet you in the beginning of the film i'm like whoa that's not the benedict that i know what on earth is going on here and i you know for the first time in knowing you i really like hated you i thought you were horrible and so just grotesque and awful and as the film progresses what i loved about it was that it has these themes of toxic masculinity and
01:01
gaslighting but it explores the problem rather than the problem of being present and it kind of not that his actions are justified in any way but it you understand why he is the way he is i think you know that takes jane uh and it takes thomas savage i think this man is utterly wrapped up in a pretzel of hate and pain and you discover what the causality is behind that and you know i think this is a hard watch you know it's just behind what i say is repugnant and i think i've had some
01:33
reactions to people saying i can't watch all of your film you're so awful i don't know why i'm doing american accent but the majority of people spoke to do you have american accents um and uh about it and they just feel so disgusted and or like you said sort of i don't know their security in watching me as performers sort of on the mind because i was totally committed to being in in the right various colors and i i then get the reaction of people that you know they go back to it maybe a
02:03
second time through or even like you start off in this position of being repelled and then lean in and see him as what he is really she's a tragic figure and i think i think the most important aspect of it you completely hit the nail on the head is to actually you know look under the hood and examine why this behavior happens because yeah it is something that's prevalent in our culture it is something that 100 years on from this story is still sadly very very prevalent in but you know at all levels of society whether it's strong men on the political
02:35
field or whether it's just you know people can we encounter on our day-to-day thankfully not too many in our business but it does exist and we're not going to be able to move on from the conversation at least at the beginning the most important thing is to support survivors of abuse sure to stand with them and ally with them but once that has been done we also need to have the conversation about masculinity about what the causes of it becoming toxic are
03:07
in order to be able to be better fathers to our sons to bring them up as feminists as people who truly understand that equality inclusivity and gentleness and kindness and this man has suffered a lot in his youth in an era where his true self his true sexual identity is not only not understood by the world and criminalized by the world but also not understood by himself because he has no other context to understand with apart from the one person he loved who dies when he's 19. that's in the book it's
03:37
not in the film but he witnesses bronco henry being trampled to death in a corral accident um so everything about him everything about his development is arrested it's it's stunted and that's how bad it can get you know that it's not to lay all the blame on that um it's it's but it is a combination of that his brother who through that time has maybe understood or known about it but never ever addressed it moving away from him after this 25 years
04:10
course of century celebration that he is the only legitimate way he can bring bronco back into his life as this sort of figurehead and then legendary kind of what he wished he was really um for everybody um and that celebration is of no interest to a brother who's looking to the future the only thing my character phil can do is to look to the past in order to make sense of who he is he's denied that in the beginning then the person who really denies him his brother is this woman who he
04:40
sees as a threat he doesn't want to examine her as anything other than the threat he feels and becomes defensive and aggressive in gaslighting and psychologically torturing towards her because he feels she's stealing something he and his brother bill and then this son who in the first instance is a point of ridicule to make you know the men laugh and then beyond that when he becomes real through their rose and george's marriage he could be the next heir to this land this show fortune this this work
05:11
that with bronco without rocket they've built over 25 years so it's like a perfect storm in this character's heart and soul and psyche and i i think he's capable of great cruelty there are anecdotes in the book there's a gift obviously a flashback to fill in his past his backstory but um everything that you see in the film for me comes from all of those ingredients cooking away at boiling point and and so naturally playing of course i understand i feel for the guy despite
05:42
the horrendous collateral damage he does in destroying a woman's confidence and forcing her to drink to survive and and reducing the the young man's tears and being pretty hard on on everyone and not suffering fools clapping so yeah it you really hit it on the head and i think that's one of the key draws and i don't know what it would have been like in anyone's hands but jane because this is incredible she's extraordinary i think you know without she's not vilified him she's much exactly that needs understanding rather than
06:13
just painting into a corner of being the bad guy yeah see that's what i loved about the film was that i was constantly second-guessing my decisions as to whether i liked you or sympathized for you you know and i think a really interesting thing because i've watched a few video essays about the movie since i watched it and something i don't think anyone has picked up on is whether um george's character is aware of his abuse because more so than any character he seems to give phil
06:43
kind of a free pass anytime he behaves incredibly badly george is almost apologizing to him especially when he asks him to wash up and i wonder whether how how you feel about the thought of did he understand the trauma and the abuse that phil had gone through or is that something he's oblivious to i think i'm so conditioned to my opinion through the sort of very isolated and singular focus i had on on phil and also the book itself is a very phil centric experience so
07:14
that solidified in my head that george didn't have a clue that just you know he's adults he's he's somebody who's codependent and doesn't know any other life outside of being body shamed and t and having his goat god as it says in the book uh through phil and when he when he experiences empathy and then receives empathy and kindness back from rose his whole world just it explodes in a good way he becomes capable of love and and capable of being loved however i'm not the active player george
07:45
i think i've said this publicly and then jesse's gone and you know nobody could think what he wants but i knew everything because you know and i think jesse being the kind of extraordinary um excavator of psyche and and a brilliant master of naturalism that he is you know he's got a fair point i think i don't think in that yeah i think it's very easy from the 21st century to sort of project uh a more um nuanced or subtle understanding of things i'm not saying jesse's doing that but i think sure he would have known about him and brock he wouldn't know
08:14
what it was necessarily he might know that there was some kind of intimacy there i think however underground this was however repressed homosexuality was in that era i still think people would have known it or understood it they just wouldn't have had um a means of doing that you know i mean um yeah there's no place in society obviously like we said before to kind of accept it for sure um i mean for it to be a criminal act let alone something that was sort of morally seen as being abhorrent and ungodly and
08:46
all the rest of the prejudice of that time and i think i mean this is again it's a question for jesse to answer but i think he has whether it's conscious or unconscious he has a sympathy for his brother because of that and there's other reasons he does have that same hysterical suffering of everything that phil throws it but like i said i think it not to say it's the first time he i think fatso and all the rest of the horrific kind of abusive land which he uses just so freely with his brother um
09:16
is is a pattern of old but i think it's really cranked up obviously in these moments of um of this kind of crisis coming to a head in the film and losing it this woman yeah it's interesting it's almost like a it's almost like a form of toxic masculinity in itself in the sense that to me as the audience member i was of the understanding that he had some sort of clue or inkling that this trauma and abuse had gone on and his lack of empathy or his lack of ability to say are you okay do you want to talk about
09:46
this yeah it's kind of another form of toxic masculinity in the sense that you know us is bloke sometimes we find it hard to reach out and offer a helping hand because it's weak i guess it's interesting is the other piece i for me i think it was definitely the abuse of societal i think it was a very um complicit and um actual love affair really uh between women i i think personally but i mean tell me tell me why you think it was abusive what gave you that idea
10:19
i think just the understanding though because it's like this is the most interesting thing to me is talking to people who've seen the film it's like the amount of sure he lets you in as an audience she's not prescribing right of course you know a judgment or a way of thinking about it or interpretation everyone's reaction valid so it's yeah yeah i guess for me like maybe the word abuse is the wrong word but i just assumed that your character was very very young when all of this happened the way he kind of talks in the sense that he is looking up to bronco henry
10:52
to me seems like a 13 year old boy looking up to a 19 year old boy i haven't even talked about it i know you're quite right and you're near and i can even remember big but like it's true but it's true i think if you have an older mentor there's a huge power and is it abusive power for that to become sexualized and you're quite right i i don't know i don't know and i don't think that's exactly interpretation it is up for interpretation you're absolutely right um and that's the least i i wanted to pick it up because it's the first time i've
11:23
heard that and and yeah um yeah that's it's fascinating yeah because he wouldn't have had a huge power over him for sure it definitely comes across that way i mean the way that you are in the sun and you're rubbing the handkerchief it was almost like you were hypnotized there was like a this kind of it was incredible it's an amazing thought and for me once i had the aspect of abuse was when i started to sympathize with phil
11:53
was when i that was for me the catalyst of like oh okay so this person has been through kind of what he's doing for me it's his heart broken he's still connected to there's a sensuality in remembering the man in that moment which brings him back to it being a very physical act as well as profound soulful love of another human being and i think uh yeah but i think it's that's it's just such a that's really so exciting that's what i love about this film it's kind of you know it's amazing it could be turned on its head
12:25
by someone else's reading of it um amazing something else i loved about the film is that you look online and it says oh this film's a western this film's a western and it's really not it's a tragedy it's like an epic tragedy and i saw an interview that you did and you spoke about it's a western but without guns i think the fact that you can tell this story without that and it it it's it's an incredible feat and jane campion i mean she's done an incredible job of piecing this together but um but maybe talk about the sort of
12:55
themes of this kind of great tragedy set in the you know beautiful landscape of montana it's a very interesting time um and george sort of marks the future not just because he's looking to rose but he's interested in his car and he's always tinkering his car and it is the beginning of mechanization it's a sort of transitional era which again i think sort of destabilizes phil he's very much wedded to the old way of doing things um the manual sort of analog way for a better term um but but the manual that doing things literally
13:27
with his hands even gloves to him as being a tool too many um and i think it's an era where land despite its scale is becoming more something that's become a little bit more important in a way rose's of isolation and the kind of the the difficulty of being in a place called home that becomes a prison not just because of how cavernous home is
14:04
the weather of that landscape is pretty inhospitable to those who work the land who don't work without you don't know how to survive it contain it to a degree and i think those are two very big themes that collide in that moment in history in montana um you know ranch owners were the sort of bezos and bransons of that era and these parents in particular were kind of playing at it so instead of throwing rockets into space they they go from being rich brahmanas on the east coast to taking them around
14:35
and having a go at being ranchers in the west and it's a very specific examination of that becoming then a real thing and a real way of life for both of their sons i mean george is very well into his life to an extent if not with uh bronco and his brother but you know david have both worked and got to be out for 25 years doing what they do loving what they do and yeah sold on it and they didn't they you know in the book it's it's touched on in the film as well that you know he might not
15:05
phil went ivy league and was was a a scholarly student um and yet he dresses and talks like folk he's somebody who's holding on to a level of authenticity which that kind of pioneering west personifies you've got george who's moving into the mechanized version of it you've got rose who represents hospitality and um you know the kind of the the leisure the panano the piano and you've got a son who represents literature and medicine and
15:37
education and and aesthetic which is completely the future in cody's character of peter so these characters this sort of quartet psychodrama represent in my opinion you know far far bigger themes of that shifting era um and that really is the sort of titanic beauty of the novel and again what jane i think really seizes on in the economy of her script and um and her edit of the film is within this propulsive narrative that
16:09
just continues like a juggernaut towards its sort of shocking conclusion you've got these really heavyweight themes which are so integrated within the body of the story the character that it doesn't feel that we're going hey guys um this is a political commentary on sexism guys this is a little bit like into what it was like to live on in that year it just is so embedded it's so uh about um it's so about the entire world of of the film that that i think is one of the things that kind of resonates with people um
16:38
and it it its pace you know yeah like you said there's no guns but my god you know a door snap or a clink of a spur or the sound of the banjo being played those are the gunshots those are the absolutely i think that's what's so wonderful about jane is the same with top of the lake she's uncompromising in her edit you know if something is uncomfortable she will let you sit with it and as an audience member there are moments like when she spend the piano and you're playing the banjo while you're enjoying the scene because of the drama you're like willing it to be over
17:10
her pain and it just doesn't end and it's it's it's an incredible i guess asset of hers to be so brave to allow these films to have the time and the pace to make the audience feel uncomfortable um because i haven't seen a film like it like oh ben what are you doing in this toxic mess um well you know i i agree and i i think that's one of the drawers as an actor as you know from from cherry and you're completely extraordinary and uncompromising dive into
17:42
a boy a man child being changed from an innocent falling in love to to just that character up all the way to being um an addict who eventually gets out of prison spoiler alert but you know it is such an uncompromising look at a very modern tragedy of unemployed listless youth uh the draw of the army to give structure the disparate nature of young lives because of separations around college jobs and opportunity and house prices and people seeing that as being a way to see
18:14
the world being sold that and then the devastating experience of combat itself and then those support afterwards and the psychological trauma and the ptsd and the just that you know and you know joe and anthony don't look away either um they play stuff in slow mo and it's not all just about you know you getting high in slow motion like no this is this is this is the emotion of someone who's at the very very bottom and you're wading through it with them and but still part of you is is willing that person to be to be good
18:46
it should be better to be whole to be safe to be nourished to be loved be cared for the idea behind that shot and letting it play out in slow-mo is that rock bottom feels like forever you know when you're when you've hit rock bottom or where you're going through something that's incredibly hard or depressing it feels like it's never ending and i think the idea of that shot was to make the audience understand that like there might be light at the end of the tunnel but it's a very very long way away you're fearless in what you did in your craft in that film and science and joe they're uncompromising gays on it
19:17
and so is so is jane and i think you know you know it's like working with the russos i i know it's like joking and i know you would absolutely love what you don't know what it's like working with the resources but you more intimately and i think you would any actor worth i thought would have a gen champion right of it because she she not only wants you to go to a place of really uncomfortable truth in something but she's also really a facilitating process and the space to feel confident about anything you feel secure about which for me playing this role i was so far
19:49
outside of my wheel the experience it really taught me thrilling on page and in conversation with her and then suddenly i was like oh god i bet you've got to do this and she was great she got that she look i've got confidence in we all do but you feel insecure about a thing let us know we'll help you i went right getting my horse riding western style all of it everything that that manifests his kind of um his prowess and he is you know the book he is truly a master of all of these things so i had great help and i really marinated in that character for a long time as opposed to what i
20:24
usually end up doing you know this this resonates with you just kind of it feels like you're building the plane as it's taking off most of the time yeah of course yeah i mean how often do we make a film when your first day of shooting and they're like so we're still working on the third act well we're not sure how it's gonna work as well yeah um but tell me about tell me about the process because i mean for me obviously someone that knows you very well the the physicality of what you were doing was so authentic you know in you know even the way you were making the rope the way you're riding the horses rolling your cigarettes playing the
20:54
banjo tell me about that process of building this character and and making it so on this one um i mean first first of all first just i mean as far as source material you know the book is an incredible blueprint for character and physicality and a little bit like watson describing sherlock there's such a detailed kind of uh understanding visually for me of who this character is to the point that you know i kept reading it going i don't know if i'm the right guy for this because it is you know because i'm recasting it in my head and i um
21:25
but it is spradled legs arms behind his back um his stance the way his silhouette was his type of stride the way his boots would sound how he held himself how straight his back was how strong and lean and weathered his hands were lean not not big old sausage hat a lot of laboring hands are very thick i was like okay well i got those weird hands so yeah it was your walk for me like those big expanse shots with the mountains which i'm finding out was actually new zealand
21:58
shots of you walking there's that one particular shot where you're walking through cattle and kind of you're almost like moses you're like parting away your walk is so different it's incredible it's the saddle saddle saw stride and you know he he there's also something that's very him about it it's not just oh this guy's got off the stand being on a horse for 12 hours it's like well it's also phil burbank and so it is it is that thing of having a wider strike the chats helps amazingly that's when it becomes the outside in is the
22:27
minute you have a costume fitting and uh cassidy was in our costume zone was fantastic and i really thought for those overalls the bibs because that in in the book but everyone's like ah they don't look heroic off i went this is authentic i need to yeah i really need it it looks great and she really supported me in that and then we found the hat through rehearsals it was just something i literally picked up and put on and i was quite good we went to the house they'd actually gone it wasn't right it's just a bit and also i'd grown up my beards i didn't know what they wanted um and we kept that although in the book
22:58
obviously with time jumps you know he's he does cut his beard every now and again like once every four or five or six months i think it is um but the dirt the kind of the the feeling of sweat and smell and stench and blood and sinew and all of that stuff just had to be real so i i lived that in montana for a couple of weeks i went ranching there with an amazing cowboy called randy and his wife jen and they put me up in that homestead which is on this amazing flatland prairie um
23:30
overlooking what the local tribe called the backbone of the world it really is just like this mountain range just comes out of this flat wow and then they drove me all around the state of montana to two different very different wonderful um ranches where i i experienced the branding and cattle herding and at the same time constantly teaching me to rope to braid and you know trying to pick up on my uh errors as a horse rider and an english horse writer at that so um it was it was you know i learned from
24:03
that i would love for watching men and women who do it as a living and just the animal in film just just really feeling it and rolling and we there was a movement in strikes fantastic guy worked with us in in rehearsals but there was more like okay what would phil be like if we tangled him or waltzed in with his brother which i did with jesse just to feel the body of the man that i've grown up with since we were kids in the same bedroom um you know that very sort of odd of its time very usual proximity to another man of your blood
24:34
and that was a brilliant that was jane's idea you know to just try and shift the focus in a very unusual way just getting a scene on his feet be getting a character in a very uncompromising or odd or not necessarily to do the story kind of position seeing how the body responds and then that first day was terrifying i just sort of i was introduced to still jane said which is great because it just meant i could be him you know apologetic and embarrassed and sort of people pleasing i can be and cringy and you know to be phil i just had to really part that to
25:04
the side and commit to him in all his glory um and she she went um okay everybody you're gonna be working with phil um benedict's really nice to meet him at the end of the shoot that's great um and that's awesome that she encouraged that i completely and all the other actors were in on it as well and just you know so we were i was in character around everybody all day every day and when i was on set i was whittling or i was trying to do cigarette running with one hand or practicing my whistling not the tune but the sort of
25:34
louder whistle to get the dog's attention or piece of piece of tension and banjo playing of course uh and and and that isolation that separation which is very strong in the book i just marry myself to that landscape and going this is a man who stands astride these mountains that he leans into it it offers him sanctuary and privacy and a reveal in the film which is very much what i think it is in the book as well it's it's he brings the outside in he's he's more comfortable inside it's it's
26:05
unnatural to him and letting in a town situation you know but even being inside four walls is not natural for him hence clean around in all that dirt and living in that dirt before i was born like not watching for a bit of doing some stuff yeah i can imagine that's an interesting thing that i thought that going back to what you said there about him sort of living on the outside in yeah is the cinematography like while you're talking about shots of great expanse sometimes i felt very very claustrophobic
26:37
especially when you're looking at the world through rose's eyes yeah it's she's i i don't know who that cinematographer is but she's incredible she's got some uh lady macbeth she's just brilliant and jane and her project before but they had a whole year of establishing a language and an understanding of that script and yet still despite some sort of big moments were really nimble on the day as we had to be especially on location because of what they were never every other variant but also just aesthetically going oh this huge crane spot that we plan to
27:07
majestically do this that the others like i was just put the camera down over here you know and the ability to do that to contain that huge landscape and then also narrow things down to make them like he said claustrophobic and suffocating and and also just to really examine the interior of these characters lives and to give that much space to internal thought and dialogue yeah and just let that sort of real gift of cinema on the camera facilitate performance was just wonderful and it's the great thing
27:39
again you and i are often you know giving out a lot of exposition as we're flying around um one sec or the other two green screens or to each other uh if we're lucky um to be able to sit in that place where you're saying one thing and i mean other or seeing that place where you're not saying anything that's just on you just you know that's the i don't know what you feel about that for me that is the real gift of of working in front of a camera especially one skilled as harry's and with james guidance you feel
28:10
secure but you also feel examined do you feel you can lose yourself and what you're thinking will be apparent and that's that's just a very rich place to be as that's it can you talk to me about working with cody because that's also an incredibly interesting relationship in the film and again very conflicting because you think one thing and you think that you're kind of blossoming as a character but really you're being manipulated but you're the master manipulator of the film
28:41
which is why that ending is so shocking because the kid gets the upper hand i mean this is the thing it's it's a weird thing and as i've been noticing more times i've seen it like well was this written in this you know how inevitable is this it seems there's a part of me that goes well peter didn't know his mum was going to give away those hides yeah you know he yeah he did cut off the hide of a cow that very obviously had um
29:12
okay it's called anthrax but he he didn't it was the it's the marriage of opportunity and preparation i guess yeah again why it's a tragedy it's those yeah it's going into place at the same time at the moment where phil's rage is so childish but sort of destructive and out of control that yeah you repeat you think oh right my mom is probably going to be killed now you know yeah so phil peter is a manifestation of every type of masculinity that he finds
29:44
terrifying but also offensive because i think despite the performative aspect of film there is a level of that i really believe that he has become that person has been 25 plus he is the you know hard-assed you know arch man i don't think it's just dressing up it's real for him he lives it um and that effeminately that lightness that lisp all of that stuff becomes it's just something to be swatted away and and turn into something to amuse his
30:15
men with in a very cruel way and then when that person comes into his life is a real thing it's just like he yeah he's already a place of disbelief but weirdly it's when he sees peter do the walk and be cat whistled and then come back the same direction that he goes there's something i i you know he he's missed something at peter i think peter's peter's soul character john i think he does grow from the boy who cries in that first scene to the man
30:47
who who um don't say it poison still kills him um so we're not being able to talk about that we haven't slept right now that's all done but you know he he goes he does there is a massive marked character progression but i think also he he's somebody we underestimate cody speaks very eloquently to this about how our perception and and he had it as a reader i had it as a reader is that peter is ineffectual to an extent um there's something quirky and interesting
31:20
about it you don't realize quite how capable he is and it really makes you feel square in the book religion on the last few pages of it so that it's an amazing it's a staggering reveal around the book and it i think it's a degree in our film where there are more i thought very obvious leaders but again like not being the majestical screenwriter that that um jane is uh she's completely proved right people don't guess when um he says you don't have to do this anymore to his drunk mother or when he says um oh it won't be long now phil it'll be
31:51
soon that he's talking about killing phil or stopping him um but it's my point is it's our misperception of who that character is that's truly shot and actually he's he's evolved to being that person all the way through the skinning of the rabbit the quick dispatch of the injured rabbit all these are clues some of which phil misses he in that moment by the picnic you know he has a picnic he then after watching him and being surprised by how deft he is with bringing the rabbits that he sits down and says well your dad got that wrong about him being um
32:21
we wanted his dad wanted him to be more kind more gentle um and phil thinks that's just a ludicrous assessment of this this boy this this this lily exotic thing which he's sort of vaguely attracted to or fascinated by i think at that point we're rather attracted to and he thinks that's that's just a terrible misdiagnosis and yet he's just seen him kill a rabbit with no control but tenderly but like yeah i it's it's a mismatch it's a real misstep for me it's one moment in the
32:52
film i'm going i feel really missed the trick there do you know what i mean he gets yeah there's something more about peter being content with who he is and being confident in himself with that walk when he comes back he doesn't flinch uh he doesn't take a route around the back of the tent it doesn't avoid it he gets it when he sees throughout his dispatch he gets it when when he's riding the horse and he falls off the horse and they're all saying and i think you know but also by then he's kind of fond of the guy but it's such a weird dynamic that relationship all the way through the film from being a point of ridicule beginning to being
33:23
somebody he recruits away from the mother he's literally got a rope like this he's pulling and my thing about it was when i was looking at customers just imagining ripping the umbilical cord away from my child it was that kind of good task in my mind it's that it's it's horrible yeah literally like i'm gonna take the one thing you've got left um of happiness and security and i'm gonna make him mine he's gonna come to me not you so literally it won't quite whistle for him like a dog and he turns from doing some work for his mom to get his smurf for the flowers she's trying to plant and i take him
33:54
to the barn to sort of start to um i wouldn't say groom because that's so that's so heavy with connotation i don't think that's there i think it really is he's trying to weaponize that relationship to destroy the mother and yeah he's kind of bored so he wants to see if he can turn the feet guy into who's got something about him into a cowboy um but you know the first time they go off riding together you should you should wonder whether he's gonna make him do something that's gonna result in an accident and he's gonna come back phil back on his own and oh sorry peter didn't make it you know
34:26
um and the power switch in that dynamic is just so interesting working with cody was just a dreamer because we were more intimate in that relationship i was able to be far more on the same page in a way with cody was the one or two times like i let my guard down as being a character all day every day because i felt we both needed to get that dance so right at the end we weren't talking about what effect we wanted to have but we're just encouraging you actors rather than just being a character all the time um and we're both terrible gigglers so
34:57
we would giggle a lot in rehearsal quite a lot in the of it probably undermines the gravity of those moments but we were committed we were committed when it was happening obviously um otherwise it wouldn't work but it's a very odd confusing and indefinable kind of dance of seduction at the end you don't you shouldn't really know who's leading who so that was something we you know cody's cody's wonderful um he's really straight up but he's got something profoundly mystical about him
35:28
and we both just sort of went into those parts of ourselves with kirsten you know i she had to manifest a lot of it i was off camera and torturing her for an awful lot of it you know we didn't have any scenes together but when she comes back well the the scene in yeah all of that and then and then the dining room in our house and also obviously when she first gets to the ranch that sort of cold welcome you're not my i'm not your brother you know that complete rejection of any intimacy and so it begins but then the rest of it she really had to dig deep on her own
36:04
terms because i wasn't in her presence torturing her apart from those sort of three encounters and that's again a testament to her powers and actress and she managed to manifest that and creates such a kind of landscape of suffering and pain in her in her physicality and her behavior it's just an extraordinary journey she goes on um wow yeah she's incredible in the movie amazing and she's heartbreaking well you know jesse you know that that we had a few moments a few that the scene in the barn when he comes to just suggest that like what's
36:36
up in the second one he says please we really need you and everyone's missing you um and then the ride into town and him not listening to me in in in the uh in the restaurant let's call it a restaurant um i'll do that but anyway so i'm sat there in an audience watching all these relationships playing watching my effects on characters as well i'm watching how they manifested when i'm not there whether it's george's tears on the mountaintop going i'm just so happy not to be alone it's the most heartbreaking line of the film for me when when george and rosa just got married and she surprises him with that
37:06
picnic and they do that little that little walls on that mountain top and it's just heartbreaking it just breaks away single tingles what's the matter in this i just i'm so happy not to be alone it's just like wow that's all that's it that's the secret to love and i think you know it was one of the many joys of watching the film seeing the film that i'm nodding but the the character is shaped and uh i created um
37:37
so yeah that cody fantastic and kirsten and and everyone i mean you know you know what it's like if you play anybody with any kind of authority or not it's all about the people around you it's all you are playing unless the court is playing um yeah right servant to the king and all the cowards including eddie who i'd like to honor in this chat because he passed away the films dedicated to him an older um polish actor who wrote a change a couple of times and this was an amazing sort of iconic still presence on set um
38:08
he brought his life to i'm sorry to hear that right i said yeah um it's a sad loss and yeah but everyone young and old um they're front-end behind the camera as well but you know that you know it's like you can't really do that without everyone being on side with it and helping you but also help them realize their job and do that do their work so honestly mate i was blown away by the film and you know knowing you as well dude you know you don't need me to tell you what an amazing actor you are but it's
38:39
an incredible film and the feat and the intricacies of this character no one could have done that better so congratulations mate oh dude thank you thanks for the little master class this morning i appreciate it especially especially with the book the book adaptation aspect of it but i can't thank you for taking the time means the world as a friend and you know someone who's just experienced what you're experiencing and um you know to share a bit of spider-man with you and the phenomenon that that's become um and just to watch you and work
39:12
with you in in other fair as well you know it's amazing to think that you're you're almost just at the beginning you've accomplished so much already and thank you have you get this film and have you and i talk about it as friends and colleagues my pleasure honestly i really enjoyed it congratulations especially to everyone involved i mean

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